problems with program download with windows 7

S

sierra_uniform

Member
Hi all,

i have the problem, that the program download to a picaxe 08m does not work in windows 7. I am using a Profilic USB-to-Serial Bridge with latest driver and get the error message "Error - memory verification failed (Byte nnn)", where nnn are variabel values. When i take the same usb converter, the same picaxe circuit, the same powersupply, the same serial cable and connect it to my laptop with windows vista all works very well.

Using the same converter in windows 7 with other programs, hard- and software (e.g. measurement device) works very well too.

In the german picaxe forum nobody could help me. Has anyone in this forum an idea?

Greetings Hermann
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
We only officially support AXE127 and USB010 USB-to-Serial cables, and recommend the AXE127 is used. It could be worth trying the driver from the Rev-Ed site link in post #4, however this will have to be installed at your own risk.

Added : Crossed postings - Glad to see you have the problem solved.

PS : Welcome to the PICAXE Forum !
 
E

eggie

Member
memory verification failed

I am having the very same problem with an 08M and windows 7. I have just discovered PICAXE and so bought and 08m for a particular project and a 40x2 to use for hobby experimenting. I am able to programme the 40x2 without any problems on my computer that is running 64bit windows 7 (dell studio) but every time I have tried to programme the 08m I get the error message "Error - memory verification failed (Byte nnn)" as described in the first post, with random nnn.

Assuming that I had damaged the chip in some way I bought another just in case, but no avail - the new chip failed to programme in the same way. I tried all new components and breadboard but still no joy. I have tried the reset procedure.

Finally I loaded the software onto an older xp machine and it works perfectly with the 08M.

I am using an AXE026 joined to a USB010. I have double checked and the editor software and the driver for the USB010 are the latest versions for windows 7. I have now run out of ideas of how to get it to work.

Any ideas on how to get the 08M to programme from windows 7 with this arrangement?

Thanks

eggie
 
E

eggie

Member
Thanks for the welcome

I downloaded the driver from your website on the page you also gave me a link to:

USB Driver for Vista / Windows 7 (32 and 64 bit) (v3.2.0.0) (0.1 MB)

Regards

eggie
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Thanks for the update. As it's the right driver, can program the 40X2 but not an 08M it suggests a posible power supply or circuit issue for the 08M board. If using batteries make sure they are fresh batteries, and if using a 5V supply perhaps try with batteries. Also check that the download circuit 10K resistor is at the jack side of the 22K rather than at the PICAXE side.

Is this a Rev-Ed project board or something else ? If homebuilt it may be worth posting a photo for people to have a look over.
 
E

eggie

Member
Thanks

I can happily produce some photos of the board and screenshots of the problem. However, I am confident that the wiring and circuit is fully functioning as it worked first time on the XP machine (with 2 differnt 08m chips).

To make sure it was nothing I was doing, I connected the circuit to the windows 7 machine and it failed. I took it then directly to the XP machine where it worked first time. I then took it straight back to the windows 7 machine to try again and it failed.

The computer cable is connected to a breadboard using your BreadBoard Adapter and the circuit built up on that breadboard. To avoid any other wiring problems I also stripped the circuit down to the minimum circuit given in the manual.

I can happily produce a video of the problem if that will assist. Can I upload something of that size to the forum? If not, is there another way of getting it to you?

I will happly try some fresh batteries, but the current batteries were fresh last week and have hardly been used. The board and the battery supply is the same as that used for the 40x2 and I have also built the circuit on a second breadboard just in case.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
I don't think a video will be necessary and I'm sure we all believe what you're experiencing.

It works on XP but not Win 7 which suggested driver issues.

Works with 40X2 but not 08M suggests circuit issues.

Why only 08M will not work on the Win 7 PC is what's hard to fathom and find an explanation for.

What will be worthwhile is doing a Programming Editor Serial Port Test on both 40X2 and 08M on both XP and Win 7 and see if you get differing voltages on the Serial In pins of the PICAXE. They shouldn't differ but I cannot think of anything else at present.
 
E

eggie

Member
I will test this voltage on both machines and report again tomorrow. Is there a particular method for testing this, or do I simply connect the chip up and take a reading. Do I need to start the programming function to measure or will the dormant state be in order?

An additional point to note is that the programming software will detect the 08M chips and display the firmware version on the windows 7 computer..... but not programme them!! If I try to clear the memory (I have no access to the software at work so cannot remember the exact name) I get the same message. If I do a reset, immediately the power is connected I get the same message.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Yes, this is another oddity that Firmware Check works ( it has to have passed an internal firmware check to have got to the verification errors ). This situation may occur when the power supply deteriorates while data is being downloaded or where there's a fault with the cable or download circuit.

To do a Serial Port Test, View -> Options -> Serial Port -> Test Port

Click the 'on-screen LED' which should toggle on and off and measure the voltage on the Serial In of the PICAXE chip; leg 6 for 40X2, leg 2 for 08M. The voltage should be close to zero or slightly negative when the LED is off, close to the PICAXE supply voltage when the LED is on.
 
E

eggie

Member
Thanks hippy

Here we go - fresh set of batteries

Supply voltage from battery 5.0V
Serial In when LED off - slightly negative
Serial In when LED on - 3.2V
Same voltage on both machines and both chips

Looks like you are onto something here with that voltage.

Where to from here??
 
B

BeanieBots

Moderator
eggie said:
Thanks hippy

Here we go - fresh set of batteries

Supply voltage from battery 5.0V
Serial In when LED off - slightly negative
Serial In when LED on - 3.2V
Same voltage on both machines and both chips

Looks like you are onto something here with that voltage.

Where to from here??
Click to expand...
5.0v from a battery is very rare:confused:
Can you explain in more detail what your ACTUAL supply method is.
Type of battery? Number of cells?
Is this via a regulator? Does it have the required capacitors?
If a regulator, what is the INPUT voltage?
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
I agree with BeanieBots that 5V is unusual for batteries, and that 3.2V doesn't look right; not for USB010+AXE026 which I believe puts out +/-10V - Could it be that you have the download circuit wired wrongly with the 10K closest to PICAXE making a potential divider ? Not sure how if using the breadboard jack adapter.

Maybe you should post pictures of your breadboard and adapter.

To pre-empt; yes, it seems odd that if the voltages seem the same on all boards and all PC's ( even if wrong ) that it's just one board which fails but it could be borderline and drops below borderline when download starts.

Added : Just a wild guess ... do you have the breadboard jack interface plus the 22K/10K download interface fitted ?
 
B

BeanieBots

Moderator
hippy said:
Added : Just a wild guess ... do you have the breadboard jack interface plus the 22K/10K download interface fitted ?
Click to expand...
Good hunch. Maths works at ~3.1v for that arrangement which would be very borderline and VERY prone to slight variations in supply voltage and individual PICAXE dependant.
 
E

eggie

Member
There are three duracel batteries in one of your standard holders.

They were brand new when I took the reading - just checked again and now reading 4.8v when not connected to anything, so could have made a error on the reading.

I had the same thought about the relative positions of the resistors and so built a new supply from scratch to make sure - but same result and I have double checked the connections

Attached is a photograph of the setup.

Also taken voltage readings on the cable unconnected

LED Off
connector 2 relative to 1 = -5v
connector 2 relative to 3 = -6.2v

LED On
connector 2 relative to 1 = 5.5v
connector 2 relative to 3 = 6.7v
 

Attachments

B

BeanieBots

Moderator
It's a small breadboard so this might not apply, but many breadboards have a break mid-way down the power rails. Try making the downloader adapter 0v connection close to the 0v power connection rather than at the far end of the breadboard.
Also, try adding a 100nF decoupling capacitor across the PICAXE.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
The breadboard looks okay. I'm not clear on what the "connectors" are which you've measured voltage on.
 
E

eggie

Member
The connections are as shown on the attached drawing - my copy of the manual at home has numbers 1,2 and 3 but I notice that the latest download has them as a,b,c.... or am I going mad??? Either way - here they are.

The voltages were taken with the cable pulled out of the socket.

Is this a problem with the download cable??
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Thanks. With 3 (Tip) being 0V and 2 (Ring) being TX from PC it seems the USB010 is putting out +6.2V/-6.7V. Not sure how that's being changed into +3.2V/~0V when it reaches the Serial In pin from previous measurements. Two possibilities are a voltage divider with same R top and bottom, or the PICAXE power supply being 3V - neither of which would seem to apply.

Will need to think on this some more.
 
E

eggie

Member
A thought - if I were to change the resistors on the connection to the breadboard so that the LED On voltage reflects something closer to 4.5v is this likely to cause problems? I appreciate that this would be a work-around but it will get me going on the 08M this weekend. The other consideration is what it does with the LED Off voltage. Are there any maximum voltages I should not exceed on the chip.

I would welcome your thoughts. Thanks.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
I'm reluctant to recommend changing the resistor as it's not clear where the fault lies. A better workround would be to use the computer which does work with the 08M. There are limits to voltage that can be applied to the PICAXE but it's more complicated than that for the download circuit; it's a matter of how much voltage and how much current.

As well as checking the continuity of the breadboard contacts used for 0V and power, three things you can also do -

Disconnect the cable and the AXE029 breadboard adapter and measure the values of the two resistors; they look okay in the photo but you never know. Also check it's the 10K connected to the 0V, not the 22K.

Red - Red - Orange = 22K
Brown - Black - Orange = 10K

With the breadboard adapter not plugged into the breadboard but with download cable connected check what voltage there is between "0V" and "IN" for a LED test.

I believe the breadboard connector is self-assembly so check that you don't have any shorts or solder bridges.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Just tested two USB010 + AXE026 on my desktop PC and laptop on battery power ( one a genuine Rev-Ed USB010, the other absolutely identical but obtained elsewhere ) and for the LED test and reading voltages on the jack plug in free-air, they are giving me -

LED off = -9.0V
LED on = +9.6V

That fits much closer to the +/-10V I expected to see than you are reading.

With an 08M at 5V, reading the Serial In pin on the PICAXE ...

LED off = -0.6V ( 0.0V - 0.6V )
LED on = +5.7V ( 5.0V + 0.7V )

At 4.5V ...

LED off = -0.6V ( 0.0V - 0.6V )
LED on = +5.2V ( 4.5V + 0.7V )

At 3.0V ...

LED off = -0.6V ( 0.0V - 0.6V )
LED on = +3.7V ( 3.0V + 0.7V )

That's completely consistent and as expected for an uncalibrated meter and my rounding.

It looks like the root problem may be your USB010 only putting out -6.2V / +6.7V. I'm not sure why that would be - current limiting of the USB port ?

That could perhaps also explain the drop to near 3V with the cable connected. Try a LED test with everything connected but measuring the voltage where the 10K and 22K join on the breadboard adapter.
 
Last edited:
E

eggie

Member
I have taken the measurements both at the pin of the 08m and at the point of connection to the breadboard last night and there is no difference between the values - so there is no determinable reduction in voltage across the breadboard.

I have not tested the voltage at the jack plug in free air on the xp machine and will do tonight.

I have also just borrowed a usb to serial adaptor for over the weekend from our company IT dept and will test the voltages that this gives out as well. It is an ATEN UC-232A. Do you know of any problems with this particular cable at all??

Thanks
 
Last edited:
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Pass on whether the ATEN cable will work. Test on a known working system which can download into a PICAXE; if it or the drivers do not support 'break signalling' it won't work with a PICAXE. It appears it does and appears to use a Prolific chipset so you may get lucky without needing to install any drivers.
 
E

eggie

Member
I have spent the last 2 days trying to get to the bottom of this problem.

First of all, I discovered that I was getting some conflicting readings on my multimeter (an old analogue type) and so was driven to buying a new one (all singing and dancing this one!). Figures are now dramatically different to the last one but consistent and replicable and so I have started again and attached is a table I have produced of the result.

The current has been measured between the cable connection module and the Pin In.

I have tried to monitor the current flowing between the cable connection module and the Pin In when the programme is being uploaded - the current changes throughout, but I have tried to give a typical value.

As far as I can make out, there is no significant difference in the voltages between the XP and 7 computers when connected to the breadboard, but the voltages with the jack in free air are dramatically different.

When connected, the ATEN cable is generally giving very slightly different readings but the 08M will still not programme from windows 7. Otherwise the ATEN cable worked perfectly. The programmes I uploaded were very small just to test the system (simple switching of a pin).

Desperation now - I have constructed a new cable so that with the ATEN cable and this one I have completely changed the cables but still no success. - I have even taken the connections to right next to the 08M just in case (see photo). It works first time on the XP computer.

The effect is the same with different copies of the chip and each of the serial to USB cables. It is also the same on every USB on each side of the windows 7 computer (it has USB's on both the left and right).

I have checked and all the drivers for the USB ports are up to date.

As far as I can see, there can only be three reasons for failure.

(a) - a computer hardware problem.

(b) - there is a software confilict between the 08M and Windows 7.

(c) - there is a faulty batch of chips.

I presume that others have no problem programming the 08M from Windows 7 which would rule out (b) and I presume that all chips are tested before they are sent out which rules out (c), that then points to Dell USB ports being different to others but this itself is very remote as they work with all other hardware. Can anyone think of anything??

Thanks
 

Attachments

J

jaka

Member
"I presume that others have no problem programming the 08M from Windows 7 which would rule out (b)"

No problems.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
You can forget 'current' as it won't tell you much, the most important figures are the voltage readings on the Serial In pin of the PICAXE.

Despite the lower than expected USB010 output voltages, both USB010 and ATEN are giving expected voltage levels on the pin. In theory then everything should work.

None of the possibilities really explain why just the 08M won't work with Windows 7, and this is why I'm at a loss to imagine why it might not work in one situation but does in another when all the important characteristics seem almost identical.

I'd try with a different 08M.
 
E

eggie

Member
When it would not work the first time I assumed that I had damaged the chip and so (also assuming that they were fragile) I bought 5 more. I have just tried all 6 of them and every one will not work on windows 7. I have tried 3 of them on the XP and they all worked and so I have no reason to think that the rest will not.
 
hippy

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
That amount of testing seems reasonable. I really don't know what to suggest apart from trying an AXE027 with the Rev-Ed drivers. If that doesn't fix things I'd personally start to suspect it's a Dell issue or a Dell plus this installation of Win 7 issue.

What's the exact model of the Dell and full details of Windows 7, Home or whatever, 32 or 64-bit - perhaps someone has the exact same setup and can say whether it works for them or can offer advice.

Do you have access to any other Windows 7 PC's so you can try the same setup on those ?
 
E

eggie

Member
Thanks very much for your help - I am resigned now to it not working.

For information my computer is a Dell Studio 1558 running 64 bit windows home premium. I have no access to any other Windows 7 computer.

I will use up the 08M's borrowing the XP machine to program them and then buy only bigger chips and use those. Hopefully this problem will only be restricted to the 08M but if I get the same problem on other chips I will give up more quickly in the future!!

Again, many thanks for your time and effort.

eggie
 
B

BCJKiwi

Senior Member
I have a bizarre problem with Win7 and USB (Not Picaxe related).
USB works fine for most things. Have a Canon "all in one" and all functions (e.g. scanner) on the Canon work OK except colour printing which throws up connection errors. Also, a Kyocera Laser priner routinely 'won't wake up' and requires the USB cable to be pulled and re-inserted.

All these functions worked perfectly with the same PC when running Windows XP.

The conclusion is that the USB functions in Win7 are not as robust as they might be.

Have tried extensive re-installs, etc etc all to no avail.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top