Automatic Chicken Door Opener

tiiiim

Member
First off, great forum. Been cruising through for a few days now, looking at all the horribly complex projects all you boffins are completing, and thought I’d chip in with what I’m currently doing/planning to do. The aim is to explain my project and attract as many comments and as much criticism as possible so the project can be improved!

So, as the title suggests, I’m making an automatic chicken coop door opener. Chickens tend to rise and go to bed with the sun (i.e. dawn and dusk). During the summer months they wake VERY early, and if the door isn’t opened for them the chickens get particularly cross. They make this anger audible. The reason for closing the door in the first place is that our area is crawling with foxes and cats who would, given half the chance, quickly run off with one of the ladies during the night.

I actually made an automatic door 5 years back with two mechanical timers and 5 relays, but it was horribly unreliable. Having discovered the PICAXE last week, I’ve been messing around and I think this is the answer. Coupled with a sturdy and reliable guillotine-type door we can hopefully say bye-bye to early mornings!

So here’s the plan: 08M chip. LDR senses daylight. At dawn (I’ll have to fiddle the ADC value) the chip arms a relay, which will drive the 12V motor and pull up the door. Once the door is opened a switch will close, providing an input into the chip and stopping the motor. The switch will also turn on an orange LED. At dusk, the chip arms another relay which will drive the motor in the opposite direction (closing). Again, another switch will input into the chip once the door is closed, stopping the motor and switching on a red LED. That’s pretty much it.

Now some points:
  • I know there is a driver array available to drive the motors, instead of using two relays. However, as I already have the relays, and NPN transistors, and as the driver array still requires two outputs, I’d rather not spend the money.
  • I’m not sure which type of switches to use for the open/closed sensing. The 5 year old door uses magnetic reed switches, but I found that the chickens would sometimes knock the door which caused the magnet to move out of range of the reed switch. As a result, I’m thinking of just using push-to-make switches at the top and bottom of the door frame, and as the door is pushed onto the switch (or falls onto the switch when closing), this will provide an input into the chip.
  • Alternatively, I could just run the motor for a pre-determined length of time to open and close the door – this way I’d have two free input/output pins which I could do other funky stuff with. The state of the door would be stored in the EEPROM as a simple 0/1 (true/false) variable, which will be checked when the relay is about to be activated. But then I’d never know if the door was actually open/closed (snapped/tangled/mangled wire etc).
  • I was actually thinking of having a combination of switch and timer: if the switch is not activated after a pre-set amount of time (a bit longer than the door would take to open/close), then stop the motor anyway and provide some sort of error signal (perhaps flash both red/green LEDs?).

So, some questions:
  • What do you reckon to the circuit diagram (attached – apologies for the quality: first time EAGLE user) and code? I know the code could be condensed by combining the CLOSE and checkClosed functions (labels), but it seems a bit easier to read for me at the moment!
  • If I wanted to leave the serial jack out of the board (i.e. program the PICAXE on another board), what do I do with leg 2 (SERIN) – can I just tie it to ground with a 32k (10k+22k) resistor (as in second schematic)?
  • Is it possible to do what I want using less pins than I’ve already allocated?
  • Has anyone else done something similar? If so, how did you determine the state of the door (open/closed)? Switches – if so, which?
  • This is going to be on all day, every day. Should I foresee any problems with running this device 24/7?

Looking forward to your thoughts!
Tim

CODE:
Code:
' Automatic Chicken Door Opener
'
' Dawn: will open the chicken door
' Dusk: will close the chicken door
'
' Dawn/dusk detected by a LDR
' Motor driven in opposite directions using two relays
'
' When door closed, red LED lit
' When door open, green LED lit
' When door moving, orange/amber LED lit

let dirs = %000011010
symbol openSwitch = pin2	'INPUT pin for door-open-detect switch
symbol closeSwitch = pin3	'INPUT pin for door-closed-detect switch
symbol doorOpen = 1		'OUPUT pin for door open relay
symbol doorClose = 0		'OUPUT pin for door close relay
symbol door_is_open = b0	'Boolean variable to store whether the door is open or close
symbol light_input = b1		'Int variable to store the amount of 'sunlight'

'FUNCTION: main body
main:
	'read 0,door_is_open							'EEPROM CODE: Read eeprom value
	readadc 4,light_input
	if light_input<50 then								'Dusk is detected
		if openSwitch = 1 and closeSwitch = 0 then CLOSE	'Door is open, so close it
		'if door_is_open = 1 then CLOSE 				'EEPROM CODE: Door is open, so close it
	elseif light_input>=200 then						'Dawn is detected
		if openSwitch = 0 and closeSwitch = 1 then OPEN		'Door is closed, so open it
		'if door_is_open = 0 then OPEN						'EEPROM CODE: Door is closed, so open it
	endif

	pause 60000			'Take a (long) breather. Turn down for simulation testing!
	
	goto main			'And round we go again


'FUNCTION: Activate when you want door to close	
CLOSE:				
	high doorClose		'Activate the CLOSE relay (R_CLOSE on the schematic)
	goto checkClosed		

	
'FUNCTION: Activate when you want door to open
OPEN:					
	high doorOpen		'Activate the OPEN relay (R_OPEN on the schematic)
	goto checkOpen


'FUNCTION: Checks for input during the door closing	
checkClosed:			
	if openSwitch = 0 and closeSwitch = 1 then	'Constantly check to see if the door has hit the closed switch
		'TIMER could go in here instead of IF statement
		'door_is_open = 0					'EEPROM CODE: write 'false' to door_is_open (door is closed)
		goto finish						'Once the closed switch has been hit, finish off.
	endif
	goto checkClosed


'FUNCTION: Checks for input during the door opening	
checkOpen:				
	if openSwitch = 1 and closeSwitch = 0 then	'Constantly check to see if the door has hit the opened switch
		'TIMER could go in here instead of IF statement
		'door_is_open = 1					'EEPROM CODE: write 'true' to door_is_open (door is open)
		goto finish						'Once the opened switch has been hit, finish off.
	endif
	goto checkOpen


'FUNCTION: Final tidying up after movement, then back to main body	
finish:				
	let pins = %00000000					'Turn off all relays
	'write 0,door_is_open					'EEPROM CODE: write door_is_open boolean to position 0
	goto main
 

Attachments

Jeremy Leach

Senior Member
Great project ! .... you've obviously put a lot of thought in already. The only comment I've got at the moment:

I think it might be a good idea to do some sort of double-check of the light level before activating the door, to avoid false triggers. You could do a running average or maybe just take a sample, wait a while and take another and then see if they are similar.

Oh and also, I'm assuming the door decends under gravity, reeled out by the motor - i.e a chicken won't get guillotined if it's beneath the door?! :)
 

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
You've obviously got previous experience of doing this so it's mainly a task of upgrading the control system rather than implementation from start which will be an advantage. You also have a good idea of what can and will go wrong so you're well placed to know what you have to look out for.

Firstly I'd say reconsider using the 08M, consider an 18X, 28X1 or 28X2. The 08M is cheap yet powerful and may do the job but something with larger program memory gives you more scope to do cleverer things. It's only a small extra cost, and certainly so when spread over the lifetime of the system. A small saving now may be false economy as time goes on.

More program memory means more complicated algorithms are possible. You can couple light readings with elapsed time so you can tell if you get false readings ( cunning fox with a torch at midnight maybe ? ) and the doors can open after X hours even if the light sensor has failed and it still thinks it's dark. Likewise when door closing you will have room to develop more complicated routines should the chickens be trying to headbutt their way out. More I/O means you can have multiple LDR's and so forth which gives more reliability. Maybe you'll want to add a heat sensor to open the doors when the fox gives up with the torch and decides to burn the coop down :) Temperature or humidity logging may be something which one day seems like a good idea to have. If nothing else, extra I/O means you can add status LED's so the system can alert if things aren't as they should be.

You don't have to be complicated early on, a basic system as you envisage is a good start, but you are already considering, "hey, I could get clever and do this and that", and a larger PICAXE will give you plenty of scope for allowing improvements. You could think of it not as more money up-front, but as insurance against hitting limitations later.
 

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
On the issue of reed relays or PTM switches one thing to bear in mind is environmental conditions and how quickly there's deterioration. The reeds have the advantage there as can be completely sealed. Switches can be rubber shrouded etc but we all know that wear and corrosion will eventually take its toll. Maybe use both ?
 

BeanieBots

Moderator
A quick look at your relay board looks like it is possible (accidentally) to short out the power rail by selecting open & close at the same time.
If you re-wire so that the controls are direction & drive, that becomes an impossible scenario.
As already mentioned, you should fit catch diodes on the coils.
 

BrendanP

Senior Member
I have kept poultry, pigeons and aviary birds most of my life, I know in the UK you get very early sunrises in the summer, be careful letting the birds out too early if you're still in bed and foxes and cats are still doing the rounds. Its war between you and the vermin and if you drop your guard a moment they'll kill your pets.

Once you get the door opener happening you'll be well equipped to make a picaxe based cat/fox trap. You could adapt a cat carrying cage or dog crate or build a cage. You could have a IR beam that the fox/cat breaks as he walks into the trap to get the sardines. The picaxe would see the beam broken and via a Q operate a solenoid that would allow the spring loaded door to swing shut. You could also hook up a 433mghz txer to alert you that the trap had been sprung. There plenty of info on the forum about rf coms with picaxe. If you didnt want to bother with rf coms you could just run a lenght of fig 8 cable to you bedroom with a piezo at the end. The picaxe would play "happy birthday" when you caught something.

If you get the neighbours cat you can let it go, if its a fox or feral cat put the whole trap in a large garbage bag and put the mouth of the bag over the exhaust pipe of the car. Its sounds harsh but once youv'e seen your pets ripped to pieces by predators you tend to adopt a take no prisoners atttitude.
 

SilentScreamer

Senior Member
I have kept poultry, pigeons and aviary birds most of my life, I know in the UK you get very early sunrises in the summer, be careful letting the birds out too early if you're still in bed and foxes and cats are still doing the rounds. Its war between you and the vermin and if you drop your guard a moment they'll kill your pets.
Perhaps a real time clock chip as well then? Have the chip check against time rather than just light?

Either that or someone posted a circuit for generating 2KV from a 9V battery a while ago, should deter a fox (or perhaps fry it with a bit of modification) :p
 

hippy

Ex-Staff (retired)
Perhaps a real time clock chip as well then? Have the chip check against time rather than just light?
Probably don't need a real time chip as sunset and sunrise give a generally consistent day synchronisation. Some sort of 'windowing' adjusted by when those events occur with respect to what the window currently is should give reasonably reliable timing even without having any accurate timing. A sort of low-tech PID would probably do.
 

tiiiim

Member
Thanks for the replies so far guys - very interesting reading!

@Jeremy_Leach: Sounds like a good idea to average a few values of light before deciding to open/close the door, especially as I already have a 6min-ish pause in the code. And yep, the door is gravity assisted on the way down, being reeled out by a motor (not pulled down!!) - not killing a chicken was a top requirement for this project! To be honest, the chickens go inside their house as soon as light begins to fade, so as long as the door closes a little while after, there shouldn't be any stray heads...!!

@manuka: Looks interesting - I'll have a look.

@SilentScreamer & BeanieBots: Aren't diodes D1 and D2 the ones required? It's probably because the schematic isn't very clear, but diodes D1 and D2 are in the exact same position as those on page7 of Manual 3 (good memory, by the way!)

@hippy: You won't need to tell me twice to upgrade the chip - I was hoping someone would say that to give me a valid excuse!! As you've probably guessed I'm only using the 08M because that's what came with the starter pack, but I hear you with all the bells and whistles which could be provided by using better chips. I initially wanted to use multiple LDRs for the exact reasons you mentioned, but I ran out of legs! Chickens headbutting doors won't be a problem - they're well behaved and sit up on their perches once they've wandered inside!
As far as elapsed time is concerned, I'm presuming you mean with a crystal of some sort, rather than a simple pause loop? I come from a coding background so am very used to time() functions and commands etc, so perhaps even uploading tables of sunrise/sunset for the year for the chip to lookup the day's times is an idea?

@hippy: Good point about the switches, especially as chickens will be dragging straw/mud/water/crap into the coop with them, potentially destroying a mechanical switch, if it doesn't short/disable the switch first.

@BeanieBots: You're right, I could short it - this was known, but I forgot to implement a solution in the code: I was just going to ensure that when I called HIGH CLOSE I also call LOW OPEN. In addition, I guess I could use diodes...
You say
If you re-wire so that the controls are direction & drive
... What does that mean? What 'controls' are you referring to?

@BrendanP: I should point out that they hen-house/coop (whatever we're calling it now!) is already in a fairly well protected run, with deep wire fences and a ceiling. To be honest, the fox would have to pull off a Great Escape stunt to get in, so the only reason for the door is security for that 'what if...?' situation. As a result, opening the door too early shouldn't (or hasn't yet, I should say) cause any problems - although I wouldn't want to wake the birds up too early: they also get quite vocal when hungry and there's no food around!
Your second paragraph is genius: just what I was kinda thinking. I should really post a photo of the setup, but inside the main chicken run there is the hen-house and a smaller top-security mini-run. This mini run is completely surrounded by chicken wire (all walls, ceiling and even floor) - kind of a chicken-wire box. The chickens first step into this when leaving the hen-house, traverse the mini run and then get into the main run through another opening. As a result, the only way a fox could get to the main door is through the first opening into the mini-run: perhaps an IR sensor here which, when broken when the door is closed (i.e. at night) disables the door from opening in the morning until the threat has been verified (ideally by sophisticated CIA camera devices, but most probably by a human..!)

All these ideas obviously require a better chip, which looks like the way forward. Perhaps overkill, but who cares!!

Keep the comments and suggestions coming, and thanks everyone so far!! Amazing responses!

Tim
 

SilentScreamer

Senior Member
@BeanieBots: You're right, I could short it - this was known, but I forgot to implement a solution in the code: I was just going to ensure that when I called HIGH CLOSE I also call LOW OPEN. In addition, I guess I could use diodes...
You say ... What does that mean? What 'controls' are you referring to?
I think he means to keep the relays but have one controlling on/off. The other controls the direction the motor goes in (forwards and reverse). I can post a circuit if this still doesn't make sense.
 

tiiiim

Member
I think he means to keep the relays but have one controlling on/off. The other controls the direction the motor goes in (forwards and reverse). I can post a circuit if this still doesn't make sense.
Even if he didn't mean that, your suggestion makes sense! So if we take my first schematic where I use Pin0 for CLOSE and Pin1 for OPEN, re-arranging the relays as you describe would mean (for example):

Pin0: OFF; Pin1:OFF --> No movement
Pin0: ON; Pin1: OFF --> Close
Pin0: ON; Pin1: ON --> Open
Pin0: OFF; Pin1: ON --> No movement

Just realised, that makes probably no sense without a diagram - so I've attached what I think you mean!
 

Attachments

Jeremy Leach

Senior Member
Another thought ... in theory I expect you could go green and have a little solar charger/battery. Even in the UK you might be able to muster enough charge to run a motor for a few seconds twice a day? The picaxe could sleep or nap for long periods to conserve juice.

Maybe it's unreliable though and on a cloudy day you'll wonder why the chickens aren't out :)
 

tiiiim

Member
@ Andrew Cowan: True! I only did that because those are the relays which I have at the moment: double-pole, double-throw (DPDT). Don't see much point in going out to by a single pole specially for this, as I've got bags of space to play with! Good spot!

@ Jeremy Leach: The solar idea is something which I've got in mind, and something I've been playing with off-and-on for a few years now. I've discounted it because as you say, I think it'd be too unreliable, with the added complexity of batteries and solar panels (solar panels which I'd have to buy in and locate somewhere where the chickens can't fly/jump onto and poo on it!). However, I'm pretty sure that, with a 5V or 6V motor running twice a day, a reliable solar system would work just fine!! I think I'll stick to running a 240V wire into the run with a fuse box and transformer - that way I could even go the whole hog and electrify the fence at night...
 
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QuIcK

Senior Member
em, just a thought. this will be a once-in-a-blue-moon senario:
  • crystal clear night, and full moon. (at night)
  • dark heavy clouds, thunder-storm esque (during the day)
  • mayb even lighting at night.
they could cause false-triggers.
might be worth doing an average.
Code:
symbol ave_level = b0 'running average level
symbol inst_level = b1 'instantanious level
 
gosub get_light_level 'returns in b1 "inst_level"
ave_level = ave_level + inst_level
ave_level = ave_level / 2
if ave_level > trig_level then
        'open door
else
        'close door
end if
pause 10000 ' or sleep. low power something, for a few minutes
this will level out any sudden changes like flashes of lightning.

as for the moon detection. it might be worth filtering the LDR. you can get "gel" for theatre lights to tint them. i would say there is more green light in sunlight than in moonlight (moon light is blue, sun is yellow). so either get some green or red gel (green and red light makes yellow), and that should reduce the level of moonlight getting through.

as for dark stormy days... err. some sort of barometric pressure sensor :rolleyes:. mayb thats 5 or 6 early mornings a year.
 

Jeremy Leach

Senior Member
I'll throw this one in, but not sure ...

Have two light sensors, pointing East and West. The difference in light level between the two 'might' help to tell the difference between a dull day and a bright, moonlit night. :confused:
 
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eclectic

Moderator
And I'll throw in a really whacky one:
"Customer survey"

Install a microphone in the chookhouse.

Read the average sound level.
Read Light sensor.
Record a table of results.

What level of light wakes up chickens and make them noisy?

Round here, the dawn chorus seems amazingly sensitive to
even the slightest light in the morning!

e
 

slimplynth

Senior Member
JML chicken blindfolds? They sell them at Wilkinsons.

edit: :p just checked online, unfortunately they are out of stock... sorry :)

A pressure sensitive mat on the inside of the chook house is my only half-sensible suggestion... Darkness overiding the pressure mat, unless temp exceeds X°C
 
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eclectic

Moderator
Thinking further about post #19.

How about an "On demand" door opener?

Microphone/sensor.
They make a hell of a racket when they want out.

Then, let them out.

Pavlov rules! (sort of)

e
 

SilentScreamer

Senior Member
Is it possible to filter out low frequencies? I think a chicken will be higher pitched than lightning or something hitting the shed.

Alternatively just average the light readings over 5 or 10 minutes? Though where is the fun in that :p
 

Andrew Cowan

Senior Member
A high pass filter will only pass through high signals. Use a small capacitor in series with the input.

5-10 minute average does not allow for the moon, clouds, patient foxes with torches etc.

A
 

tiiiim

Member
An on demand door opener? What about when the microphone picks up shrieking kids (a few in the neighbourhood, though why they'd be shrieking at night...babies?) Also, what if the chickens wake up during the night from a nightmare... :rolleyes: I have a feeling that the chickens can sense when something dangerous is near, which is when they start to shriek - so fox comes in to the mini-run, chickens sense and shriek, door opens, dinner is served.

I'm not sure that the moon will be too much of a problem. If, as another post suggested earlier, I ensure that I know how much time has elapsed since the door last closed, won't that be enough to discount the moon? I could somehow just leave values in the EEPROM at set time intervals, and if the door open command is received, I first check to see how long since the door last closed - some fiddling would be required, though, for the seasons...

Good suggestions though - crazy ideas tend to bring out the most innovative suggestions!
 

tiiiim

Member
Tell you what though - if a fox entered carrying a flashlight, climbed to the LDR's and switched them all on at the same time, then strode into the hen house and nabbed a chicken, I'd feel he was entitled to one...
 

BrendanP

Senior Member
You could train the chickens to open the door when they wanted to go in and out. If you have kids it would be a good project for them to work with you on.

I saw a while ago where the US coast guard ran a project where they had a pigeon mounted in a plastic half sphere underneath a aircraft. The birds had been trained to press a switch whenever they saw anything orange in their field of view. Once they saw something orange and pressed the switch some food would drop out in front of them. So if the aircraft was doing S&R and the birds saw someone in the water with a orange life jacket on the birds would trigger on it. Pigeons have very good eye sight so they see more than humans at longer ranges.

So you could put one of the (hungry) chickens in a smallish cage next to the door with a push button switch mounted where the bird can easily peck it. Hot melt glue/double sided tape a few grains of wheat etc. onto the switch. On the other side of the door have a bowl of food all ready to be scoffed down. The bird will peck at the grain/switch, the picaxe will see the switch go high and then open the door, the bird will walk through and eat the grain.

It will only take a few repetitions for the bird to make the association between pecking the switch and the door opening and it should then do it without any grain glued to the switch or food in the bowl. The reward would be simply going in or out the house. You would have a switch both sides of the door to allow exit and egress.

Birds learn by watching other birds too so the others may learn off the one who has been trained or you might have to teach the others too. I'd be interested to hear how it goes.
 

tiiiim

Member
So I presume this setup is basically an always closed door which can only be opened by a chicken pecking at the button (or more accurately, anything hitting the button) - sounds interesting, and I guess could be workable. How/when would you close the door again though?

As far as kids go: I am the kid!

All I'm concerned about is that the chicken opens/(closes?) the door when they're not supposed to (i.e. when there is a predator near), although I guess the switch could be disarmed if an IR beam is broken (or something similar).

On the subject of actually training chickens, I know one guy tried to tackle the automatic door problem by using one of those windmill/rotating type doors you see in supermarkets/offices. At night, the door would just be locked in position. He found that, even using a perspex door so the chickens could see the food on the other side, they weren't having any of it and would not rotate the door and go through. Perhaps chickens learn differently from pigeons, or perhaps he had very stubborn chickens!! Who knows!
 

BrendanP

Senior Member
The door would be always closed, it would open when the birds pecked the switch. You would simply have a line of code in the picaxe prog. that would delay the closing of the door for say 10 seconds to allow the bird to exit/enter.

If there is wire either side of the door that the birds can see through I would be very surprised if they opened the door while there was a fox outside. Have a LDR on the picaxe so nothing can open the door after dark.

Have you sorted out the opening closing set up? Have a look at Manukas mechanism first, a linear actuator would work, you can make your own easily. Maybe a hack of the power window operating mechanism out of a wrecked car.

Once birds learn something its there forever, I'm think the chickens would learn this quickly. I've seen our ducks learn to come up and peck at the back door to get attention so we give them some bread. I saw crows on TV learn to drop nuts on the road so cars would run them over so they could then eat the insides.

Experimenting is what picaxe was made for so give it a go and see what happens, Even if the birds can't learn to use the thing you will learn lots and thats what really matters.

Have a look on line and read up on snares, if foxes are a problem for you and you don't want to make a more sophisticated trap you can snare the mongrels, a touch up with a cricket bat will do them the world of good.
 
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QuIcK

Senior Member
thinking about it, it doesnt need to be 2way, does it?

its to stop the chickens being an alarm clock. so when they want out in the morning, react to that (button on the inside, pressure matt on the inside, noise inside etc).
it doesnt need to let them back in. thats what you do, in your own time.

so no button on the outside, no ldr sensor or anything. just a pressure mat on the inside, when a chicken stands on it, the door opens. then close it very slowly, until it reaches home position. no decappitated or trapped & frightened chickens.

and very easy. too many stimuli to react to, and it will either need an AWEFUL lot of tweaking (ie, tweak each one individually to manage the door), or it plain and simply wont work.
 

tiiiim

Member
Back in the day we installed a PIR Floodlight in the chicken run - the intention was that if anything strolled past, the light would switch on and scare the animal away. As of today, the PIR and floodlight is still in the run.

Now, I was gonna remove the whole thing prior to the automatic door going in, as it'd probably trigger the door to open if an animal is detected - however, now I may just pull it apart and see what I can find inside it - thanks for the suggestion!

As far as training chickens goes: for some reason, I don't feel too comfy with the idea. I'm not sure if it's a good idea to let the chickens decide for themselves when to exit the house. Although the point is valid: definitely far less complex, and systems could be in place to prevent the chicken opening the door when danger is nearby. If I do go down this route though I'll let you know how it goes!

Also, I'm not really looking to trap any animals. I know that the local cats are actually scared of the chickens (they certainly give them a wide berth when stalking through the garden), so the only real problems are foxes. And to be honest, I'm not so sure that a fox would wait around for too long if it can't get to the chickens - as soon as daylight arrives they tend to disappear, especially near us as people leave for work early in the morning, start up cars and walk to school etc...

In reply to the opening/closing setup: I assume you are enquiring about the mechanics? It's just a simple quillotine style door, pull up by a motor to open, and reeled back (gravity assist) down to close. Linear actuators are definitely an option as they cannot be pulled open without turning the motor due to the screw-threaded design - i.e. it's self-locking. The down side is that a) I don't have one, whilst I do have a motor to use as a winch and b) if the system goes tits up (i.e. in the beginning), the door is stuck shut and we'd have to let the chickens out throught the roof (take the roof off) - kinda defeating the object of the whole thing! I won't discount it tough, especially if I acquire one later on!
 

Tim036

Member

slimplynth

Senior Member
these 'look' ok for 2 quid from Hong Kong on ebay.

Have a look at the advert, I draw tongue in cheek attention to features (4) through (6) :D

4) Auto switching on when detecting people coming
5) Super sensitivity within 3 meter distance
6) Wireless, easy to Install, can be used in bedroom, washing room, and on refrigerator, washer, iron door, exhaust fan and anywhere you need light





Edit: I'm tempted to buy a few but whats the possible duty £ on such an item?
 
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Andrew Cowan

Senior Member
I can almost 100% guarantee they will come marked as 'gift, value $1'. So no duty.

I've bought lots from china/ebay, and I have never had to pay customs on anything.

We will help on preventing GST, DUTY, TARIFFS, TAXES for buyers by a lowering value and gifts declaration
There you go!
 
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