Looking for a chip similar to APA102 to run with picaxe

newplumber

Senior Member
Hi friends

I dont know the chip they use in the APA102 RGB LED strips but can I get the chip only to run/power any normal 2 v led
and control brightness with SPI ...I only seen them (apa102) with the RGB attached or maybe there is better option
what I want to do is control 20 standard leds and just code it like the apa102 strips but adding my own leds and
have each one of MY standard leds addressable and control any single led for different brightness . hopefully it makes sense what i am asking
your elevator doesn't reach the higher levels friend
Mark
 

inglewoodpete

Senior Member
The APA102 is an integrated SPI controller with RGB LEDs. They don't come apart.

I'm sure there are 3-channel PWM controller/drivers out there. It's just a matter of identifying them.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Thanks Inglewoodpete I was thinking the same "don't come apart" but wasn't sure
okay so I need PWM controller so 3 channel would control 3 different PWM output lines?
I think if not to expensive ..even 1 channel controller for each led as long as i can get it
to run thru to the 2nd..3rd..etc
I'll keep looking searching
Mark
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Thanks Bill never heard of that chip then again never heard of 1M others either
but if it is controlled by one external resistor then it seems I can not control each
brightness individually but maybe I am wrong but love the ideas

edit :I will keep searching and see what I find on Monday
thanks again Mark
 
Last edited:

newplumber

Senior Member
TLC595 or TLC5916IN anyone used this driver?

Hello


My last post was closed about led drivers I don't know why or what happen I probably did something wrong
but I did order as premelec suggested a TLC595 but after searching on Mouser site I was able to find through hole ones like these
https://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=595-tlc5916In
and after searching the forums for any help on coding it ..I came up empty
I will keep studying the schematic for clues to make the picaxe 20X2 or 20M2 and the TLC591 work

Thanks Bill and premelec and others btw
your friend
Mark
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Thanks Westaust55 for doing that

@premelec
quite a bit of figuring to learn how to drive them... ;-0
If its quite a bit a figuring for you....then maybe in a few years I will be just getting to the middle somewhere on the TLC591 data sheets lol
sadly I have to google half of the words in it and still seems to fly over my head ...but ROME wasn't built in a day!
 

premelec

Senior Member
I notice TLC5940 is quite capable and Ard--o code around for it... the trick looks like very long data strings to the unit and then a latch control to lock it in... figuring out what the very long data string is for what effect you want is the basic problem - once figured it can be bit banged out or on X parts serial out... you can do it! [I'm busy... ;-0 ] Those long ND winters are coming up to give you plenty of cogitational time...
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Those long ND winters are coming up to give you plenty of cognitional time...
lol very true premelec ...so I decided to make a goal... to have this tlc591 chip up and running with a picaxe 20X2 before it hits -30 F degrees
... now back to studying/googling the 40 page datasheet (so far I am on page 3.55 :) )
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
@ newplumber : You are aware that the TL591x only offers on-off LED control not PWM brightness control of each individual LED ?

Looking at the TL5919 datasheet that seems to work in much the same way as shift register control of LED's would, with better capabilities and a Special Mode for configuring the chips thrown on top.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
You are aware that the TL591x only offers on-off LED control not PWM brightness control of each individual LED ?
No I was not aware ...lol I was hoping it would but its okay if it don't .... still going to try and see if I get all the bells and whistles to work on it
but thanks for letting me know

Seems the chip I should have is the TLC594 but every where I search says obsolete
 

inglewoodpete

Senior Member
Seems the chip I should have is the TLC594 but every where I search says obsolete
I presume you mean the TLC5940 PDIP package. I can see that the SSOP version is widely available. You can buy adapter boards like this one, also available from other suppliers. I realise it adds to the cost but beggars can't be choosers :).
 

newplumber

Senior Member
thanks premelec and IP ...I will search some more for the PDIP and if nothing pops up then I will have to become a SSOP installer
btw IP ... lol true on the beggars can't be choosers ...but the way i see it...if the hobby project cost goes up so does the value of the learning lessons :)
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
I would suggest getting to understand how the TLC5940 works before diving in, spending money, and finding it may not be usable.

Getting data into the chip looks fairly easy, but handling GSCLCK and BLANK looks like it could make things difficult in some cases. It seems to me that both GSCLCK and BLANK must be activated on a regular basis to control the brightness and to stop brightness wavering.

That could probably be done on an X2 by having a timed interrupt which generates the regular BLANK pulse with PWMOUT which provides the clocking. That PWMOUT can be turned off, the BLANK pulsed, then PWMOUT restarted.

It might actually be better to dedicate an 08M2 to being a dedicated BLANK and GSCLCK generator with some signal to provide for XLAT synchronisation.

This is all going to be a lot more complicated than using an APA102 which handles all those things internally.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
I would suggest getting to understand how the TLC5940 works before diving in, spending money, and finding it may not be usable.
@ hippy yes you are probably right....so I was thinking maybe trying a few 08m2s to use as led pwm driver them selfs ...
and to not disrespect your suggestion hippy but buying 2 TLC594s for a couple dollars and have them in hand would be the best way I can learn/fail about them
of course I will keep all my questions out of picaxe forums for this TLC594 chip unless some mistakable thing happens and I get it to work :)

@texas ...lol I'm a hockey player ...we never run.
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
of course I will keep all my questions out of picaxe forums for this TLC594 chip unless some mistakable thing happens and I get it to work :)
You are more than welcome to post questions here. I am sure everyone will do the best they can to help you get them to work, or help you work through any ideas or issues.

It's not that it cannot be done, or shouldn't be done; it's more that it might be a lot of effort for little reward. Ultimately only the person doing it can decide on that. It will have reward in itself, and you probably will learn a lot from it. If it is the way you want to go then members will be here to help with that.

I would recommend the best way to approach it is with an X2 acting as a "smart peripheral", able to background receive serial LED data while controlling the TLC594's, similar to how a serial LCD driver can be considered.

Then Phase II can be moving that to an M2. It's easier to get things working with an X2, leave additional issues which may come from using an M2 for later, rather than having to face both at the same time. There's nothing worse than seeing a project collapse or flounder because it's become too complex. Better to be halfway there with something which does work than end up with nothing at all.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Well thanks again hippy ...and I know the best people are here on this forum for any IC/picaxe related issue... but for this project
I was thinking of trying to do the hard work myself and not use the "free ride" from you pros here.
There's nothing worse than seeing a project collapse or flounder because it's become too complex.
I understand what you mean ... and none of my projects collapsed yet ...just some of them are put on a shelf waiting for smarter instructions :)
atleast my projects are low low budget if they fail compared to the Denver airport baggage claim disaster (meaning price = results).
 

JASONGONG

Banned
Hi friends

I dont know the chip they use in the APA102 RGB LED strips but can I get the chip only to run/power any normal 2 v led
and control brightness with SPI ...I only seen them (apa102) with the RGB attached or maybe there is better option
what I want to do is control 20 standard leds and just code it like the apa102 strips but adding my own leds and
have each one of MY standard leds addressable and control any single led for different brightness . hopefully it makes sense what i am asking
your elevator doesn't reach the higher levels friend
Mark
Maybe APA107 LED is bettter choice....the updated type of APA102
 

techElder

Well-known member
Did some searches for APA107, but it all seems to be from similar sources. Didn't run across any real projects or apps. Mostly saw links about a USS Goodhue (APA-107), a World War II ship.

Seems strange. Almost like spam. Hmmmm.
 

AllyCat

Senior Member
Hi,

Well, I did find a data sheet for the APA107 but it appears to have a tight specification on the bit/clock periods (+/-150ns) and a fast reset time (80us). So certainly not just a drop-in replacement for the APA102 and maybe not usable with a PICaxe at all (without additional hardware).

Cheers, Alan
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
The APA107 is more like a WSxxxx clone using just one DIN data input rather than the separate DAT and CLK inputs of the APA102.

As AllyCat notes; the 'reset idle' time being short, just 80uS, will make it difficult to control using a PICAXE if possible.
 

techElder

Well-known member
APA107 doesn't score even a hit on eBay. Does it even exist? Who makes such a product?

I'm trying not to irritate a new member, but when a new member joins just to mention a product without a reputation, then I suspect marketing hype. I could be wrong.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
lol I'm going to take hippys advice ...only 80uS? then resets? wow that is small ... ya I am staying away from it ....
seems to me its like buying a new car and after you start it ..you have .02 seconds to put it in drive or else it shuts off ...
btw I'm still putting the finishing touches on my gift I'm going to bring to my sister along with a gift card to the ear doctor :)
but after that I will be back to making some IC work ....I still have (fingers crossed) 3 - 5 weeks before it hits -20F
till i come up with something that will work ...incase the TLC594 isn't my friend
I think i will just use alot of picaxe 08m2s for the pwm ....price is about the same as any other pwm ic
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Thanks premelec another great idea (14m2) ....although I know nothing about the pca9685
about the project ....i guess i never added any details about my project but told my wife I would have a led fireplace by Christmas in our house (luckily I didn't say what Christmas)
So I bought a cheap led fire place ...flame looks horrible...but promised I try to make it (real flame) close to real as possible
and thats the whole purpose of my question on this thread ...I am planning on using 12 - 25 picaxe 20m2/20X2's ...with each running some part of a flame/coals
so it would be impossible to see any repeats but each picaxe 20m2 or 20X2 will control alot of leds with some pwm ICs
If you look at the bad flame led fireplaces which cost $250 - $500 US, I figure spend that in control and get a better flame
Now a person can say just use lots of APA102's but my thinking/hoping is i want to use my LEDs because i am going to jam them
as close as possible and using coil wire. This is a huge project but I see light at the end ...I'm guessing I should have it done with in a year.
So far I have the fireplace box all bare bones ... and have most of the new parts ....just need a few (1000) more flame tests.
Oh and the schematic still needs 40 out of 40 pages drawn out :)
IMHO soft light and amber leds mixed produce the most true flame color along with blue at the bottom (from my tests)
but most importantly find out the best (easy to code) IC with pwm dimmable brightness for each 2000 + leds and no matrix (matrix is not my friend for single led brightness)

Is that -40 deg possibility F or C ? ;-0
lol true ..took me a while to catch on ..but it is cool
 

techElder

Well-known member
There is just something strange about living that close to the Arctic Circle and desiring to purchase a faux fireplace.
 

newplumber

Senior Member
lol ya texas might be strange ...and since I have natural gas ...it would be a piece of cake to just buy a
natural gas fireplace ...but the flames on them are horrible too from all the ones i installed ... better off just using 8 bic lighters (joking)
Its going to be fun project tho ... the garbage can is real close to my testing bench :)
but i will break it down into many sections... still need to focus on many tests of pwm control
 

premelec

Senior Member
The real challenge is the sound of the fire... also with nat gas unit you can spray sodium, barium, and strontium salts on the ceramic to get pretty colors - and a feature could be PICAXE operated sprays... for the sound a small speaker and relay to discharge a capacitor into it could work... [different capacitor voltages for different pops...]
 

newplumber

Senior Member
Yes true premelec on challenge fire sound... I'm not going to get fire sound with picaxe tunes for sure lol ..I do like your idea of caps and robbers... i mean speakers
its funny I just got done playing around with the speakers to get rid of the excess noise ...now you have me thinking putting more/all of it back in it...of course if it works that would be cool
another way I was thinking to make good/horrible fire sound is to use a few servos on some hard thin plastic, but your caps seem it would never fail "IF" I put it together right. thanks tho
 

hippy

Technical Support
Staff member
Haha~ just tell you this, APA107 is the upgraded type of APA102.....
The APA107 may be a successor to the APA102 but it seems to use a single wire data transfer mechanism rather than the two-wire mechanism of the APA102.

This makes the APA107 less suitable for PICAXE interfacing. It may not be possible to use the APA107 with a PICAXE.
 
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